A Tale Of Three Walls

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Much about President Trump's wall is in the media, the organizations preparing construction bids, the cost and who will pay, how many people it will keep out and how many "American" jobs will be protected. Maybe in these and other alleged justifications there is some truth. We as individuals need to research it and reach our own conclusions. We might use an academic approach, follow the media information or rely on our own common sense approach. This last approach tells us each to consider the Wall based on our family values, religious beliefs, education through high school and discussions with friends and co-workers. We all develop our beliefs and expectations based on these interactions. Each needs to form their own opinion of purpose and value of the proposed wall.

Many of us perhaps recall the fall of the Berlin Wall. Not so many recollect when that wall was erected. Regardless the day it started coming down was hailed as a great day for freedom. The Berlin Wall was an actual symbol of the iron curtain the Soviet Union created to both keep its people in and other people out. Walls without gates have this dual purpose. This wall was viewed as not only keeping people in but also locking freedom out. The cruel dictatorship behind that wall lasted for many years. The physical wall is now history but the attitude of those who built and saw a need for that wall still flourishes today.

The third wall was built in our nation's capitol. The Vietnam Veterans Memorial stands proud not far from the White House. Many people visit this site each year and search for the names of loved ones, friends or just to imagine how much we lost as a nation in those 58,000 plus lives. Just regular kids of different races, religions, political beliefs, etc. each followed what each perceived as their duty, or belief in our country or the need to help keep other people free. Perhaps some were naïve or not well-informed or firmly committed to the purpose as good. Regardless that wall with all their names says to this nation we care about others and recognize the loss it represents.

One wall locked people in to a society without freedom. Another wall proposes to keep people out. People who only seek freedom and economic opportunity for themselves and their families left behind. The third wall says to us all we died so that others could live free. We died as American soldiers some white, some black, some native Americans, many the children and grand children of immigrants. Pride in America is found on a wall. It is the wall in Washington, D.C. along with other similar memorials to those who served and actually sacrificed for this wonderful country.

The choice is for each of us to make. When we look inside ourselves what does our common sense tell us. Which wall represents what America stands for to each of us. Each of us needs to decide what we believe and what this country represents. The world is watching. Do we really need this new wall?

Comments

Jeffry Gilbert Added Apr 16, 2017 - 8:02am
Its never going to be built. Relax. 
Phil's Personal Perspectives Added Apr 16, 2017 - 8:49am
Jeffrey,  I fully agree but the fact that the idea is acceptable to many "good ole boy and girl" types is disheartening.  Lack of knowledge might lead some to accept the concept.  How and when did we get so dumb?
Jeffry Gilbert Added Apr 16, 2017 - 8:55am
I'm the wrong guy to ask that question. :-)
Dino Manalis Added Apr 16, 2017 - 9:24am
 Trump should clearly state the wall is only meant to keep out criminals, while commerce and other legal traveling will continue crossing the border.  The wall should be solar-paneled and income-producing to pay for itself!
Billy Roper Added Apr 16, 2017 - 11:28am
Many people, even Democrats, understand that a border wall would be good for the environment:
 
https://theroperreportsite.wordpress.com/2017/04/16/immigration-bad-for-the-environment-too/
John G Added Apr 16, 2017 - 5:02pm
Pride in America is found on a wall. It is the wall in Washington, D.C.
You're proud of the genocide your state committed in South East Asia?
Phil's Personal Perspectives Added Apr 16, 2017 - 6:23pm
John, I probably wouldn't use the word genocide but pride in what this country did in Vietnam is also not a word I would use.  Many who served in Vietnam were not there voluntarily but perhaps under the erroneous belief that they were actually preventing the spread of monolithic communism.  A totally incorrect assumption based perhaps on a simple lack of knowledge.  This should be a most significant reason for each of us to stay informed and to be involved.  The importance of a free press can not be understated but integrity on their part is critical.  However when considering the concept of the three walls, the one in Washington recognizes the 58000 who believed they were helping rather than walling in or walling out.  I would rather remember those who did not actually know the reality rather than those who did but chose to take their deferments and remain silent.  Phil
John G Added Apr 16, 2017 - 6:40pm
You don't have a free press, you have a cartel of corporate propagandists.
Tamara Wilhite Added Apr 16, 2017 - 10:34pm
Their desire to come here for a better life does not trump our need and obligation to take care of the poor already within our gates. In fact, it is unfair to the poor here add to their ranks and demand that everyone just get along with competition for already limited resources whether federal programs or welfare or low skill jobs. And it is immoral to say "add these new people now, on the assumption we'll have more resources" when that hasn't happened in eight years.
We have millions in poverty whose wages were depressed by competition by legal and illegal aliens. We have millions more unemployed because immigration law and tax law reward companies for hiring people under the table or below market wages per various visas. It is immoral to add more to the workforce when these people are literally suffering in unemployment and underemployment. It is unfair to add more to the workforce or welfare roles until we have resolved this issue for our own.
 
John G Added Apr 16, 2017 - 11:30pm
If the USA stops fucking over their countries, they won't need to flee the hellholes you've created for them.
Go home America! You're drunk.
Micahel Dolan Added Apr 16, 2017 - 11:36pm
Enter your comment here...
Micahel Dolan Added Apr 16, 2017 - 11:40pm
Get in line wait your turn- don't be hauling in heroin  and one day you may legally be allowed to come to America.
Ari Silverstein Added Apr 17, 2017 - 12:20am
“One wall locked people in to a society without freedom. Another wall proposes to keep people out. People who only seek freedom and economic opportunity for themselves and their families left behind.”
 
So it’s your opinion that America should open its borders to those that seek freedom and economic opportunity?  If so, I have some news to share, those dead soldiers in Vietnam didn’t die so that Mexicans can enjoy a better quality of life in America.  We have a border because Americans fought for things that others are not allowed to enjoy unless we say so.  This border doesn’t need to be wall, even Trump admits that today.  But a border must exist to preserve our quality of life.  In addition, our way of life should serve as an example for others to emulate in their own society.   
John G Added Apr 17, 2017 - 12:36am
In addition, our way of life should serve as an example for others to emulate in their own society. 
Please tell me this is parody.
 
Phil's Personal Perspectives Added Apr 17, 2017 - 1:04am
Why is it always either or?  Is a wall a viable solution for the specific problem of illegal immigration?  Many illegal immigrants come here legally and then over stay.  The amount of illegal immigration has been decreasing over the past several years without a wall.  I do believe that America should allow legal immigration for those who seek freedom and economic opportunity.  I also do agree with your final sentence.  We need to consider any problem, immigration or others, study the causes and develop a proper solution to address the problem.  Impulsive actions and sound bites are not solutions.  As a Vietnam Veteran who was fortunate enough to return I do believe many of our soldiers believed a better quality of life for others was a part of our beliefs.  Actual solutions may be possible if we use our heads.
Dr. Rupert Green Added Apr 17, 2017 - 6:38am
If the walling is framed as a discussion on keeping out murderous raping, incest practicing, tuberculosis spreading individuals out, them Americans will support its construct, just as how they will soon support profiling and banning Muslims if we get a few of their terrorist actions France has gotten.  No Americans will care to know that large swath of mexico was "borrowed" by the US and thus favorable treatment was written in the treaty regarding Mexicans.
The wall comprising American soldiers was sent to Vietnam to keep Communists out.  This pending wall to keep Mexicans will go no where if it will interfere with commerce. Just by stop eating tacos, Mexicans can impact our export of flour.
 
Our business leaders raising outcry can stop the wall. The wall is red meat for Trump's rabid supporters. I wonder if they care about the environmental impact, where certain large cats will be kept out of the US, leaving rabbits and certain other animals to overpopulate? I wonder if they consider how it will impact the flow of rivers?
 
Additionally, with American tourists targeted around the world, how stupid it is to make travel to mexico just as dangerous as a trip to France? Ironically, it was Reagan who called for the Berlin wall to be torn down. Was it a racial injustice to keep Whites from Whites, but racially justified to keep Mexicans/Browns from Whites? 
Billy Roper Added Apr 17, 2017 - 8:53am
So they can turn the United States and other White-founded nations from homogeneous states into diverse third world cesspools of feces colored proletarian labor and consumers for them.
Micahel Dolan Added Apr 17, 2017 - 9:33am
Liberals-Marxist-Thieves-Rapist-Jihad Muslims-Come On Down all are welcome. No info on the people  Coming on down. Be sure you bring SMACK Heroin, sell it and become wealthy in America. This lunacy is the new Constitution given us by corrupt politicians and politicians who favor socialism for Americans.
Definition of Insanity- Having  millions of people get the key to your home and enter it, without knocking or ringing the Bell, for permission to enter.
 
Phil's Personal Perspectives Added Apr 17, 2017 - 2:43pm
As the grandson of immigrants who came here legally and practiced a somewhat different religion, I will answer your with "this is and can still be better with different people in it". We can not say the times, the conditions or the job opportunities are the same.  The problem is there are millions of people who are refugees and others seeking economic opportunity.  How does a wall anywhere address the problem.  In this country gated communities became the place to run to escape crime and other urban problems.  Any record check or police blotter shows how effective those walls are.  We have a problem and open borders or unrestrained immigration are not the answere.  No one that know or have read is advocating those options.  Solutions require thought and effective action.  Walling us in will not solve the problem.  I am open to any logical suggestions but yesterday's false arguments won't help.
John G Added Apr 18, 2017 - 2:43am
martin macrae
Unless you're out there trying to stop your government fucking up all the places where these refugees are coming from, then you are nothing but a whining hypocrite.
The British have caused more wars, more deaths, more poverty and more misery than any nation on the planet.
The USA is catching up, but you're still, No.1 buddy.
Jeffry Gilbert Added Apr 18, 2017 - 8:53am
Calm yourselves. It's not going to be built and it will only block DUHmerican refugees streaming south from the nuclear wreckage soon to be so deservedly delivered to you.
Jeffry Gilbert Added Apr 18, 2017 - 9:09am
Calm yourself.
Jeffry Gilbert Added Apr 18, 2017 - 9:27am
Is your obtuseness natural or have you worked at it your whole life? "Calm yourself" is a euphemism. 
 
Mai pen rai. 
John Minehan Added Apr 18, 2017 - 1:40pm
Here is a thought that should offend everyone: Radio Talk Show Host Michael Savage is right when he talks about the importance of  "Borders, Language and Culture" . . . but not in the way he thinks.
 
Based on what I saw of the Inter-German Border (sometimes called the "Inter-Zonal Border') in 11th ACR's sector in the 1980s (I was in 3d AD which supported the 11th ACR), I noticed that when the language and culture are the same on both sides of the Border, there IS no border (at least an enforceable one). 
 
If you want an enforceable Border in the Southwest, have  a plebiscite to determine which counties want to continue with the US and which want to join Mexico. 
 
After that, you could build a viable wall, but might not need one, as you would have an enforceable border.
Nexist Xenda'ths Added Apr 20, 2017 - 12:36pm
Why do pro-immigration people act as if we live in a post-scarcity society? Why are they convinced that conflicting cultural mores inculcated since childhood will have no bearing on the social attitudes  of the receiving country that the pro-immigration people profess to hold? It's all very conflicted. Moral rectitude didn't prevent science from undermining church dogma and it won't white-wash the cracks in today's modernist doctrines.
Phil's Personal Perspectives Added Apr 20, 2017 - 12:53pm
Moral rectitude and a concern based on morality are not the same.  Social mores can and do effect social attitudes often agitated by self serving individuals.  There certainly are legitimate concerns generated by immigration aggravated by illegal immigration.  Despite the use of religion as an anti immigration tool by some, history has shown instances where immigration has been beneficial to the receiving nation.  Rhetoric can never be a solution to any problem.
John Minehan Added Apr 20, 2017 - 1:06pm
"Despite the use of religion as an anti immigration tool by some, history has shown instances where immigration has been beneficial to the receiving nation.  Rhetoric can never be a solution to any problem."
 
. . . and history is replete with examples when immigration has been deleterious, even destructive, to "the receiving nation."
 
The issue is to determine which, if either, condition is implicated here.  Which (or what) approach will be taken to deal with this issue will almost certainly, be a function of whose is the more persuasive rhetoric. 
Nexist Xenda'ths Added Apr 20, 2017 - 3:42pm
Phil: Sure, the difference is when what one wishes were real conflicts with what is real. "Religion" (broadly defined) is the basis for all morals and values -- which should be a tautology, since one's view of the eternal will naturally influence one's view of the temporal.

History has shown that immigration is death and destruction for every culture that allowed it. The receiving culture is displaced and its values supplanted by the occupiers. This is the history of the world.


I suspect that you are conflating cosmopolitan centers with allowing immigration. A vibrant network of exchange and interaction improves all around (what is now referred to as "cultural appropriation" and "cultural imperialism"). Immigration displaces and destroys.
 
It also feels as though you are placing a false dichotomy (high levels of immigration or zero) rather than the natural 1 or 2 migratory persons who settle and become assimilated quickly.
Phil's Personal Perspectives Added Apr 20, 2017 - 10:48pm
John and Nexist,  you are making statements that have a factual basis.  There may be some areas where we would have to agree to disagree.  Regardless this country, the US, provides my perspective while history generally needs to guide us beyond our known world. Other parts of the world are experiencing immigration under different circumstances.  The immigration problems confronting the West generally are similar.  This immigration resulting from refugees leaving a country due to fear, war, displacement etc.  Many of these refugees or immigrants practice the religion of Islam.  Whether recently arriving as refugees or longer term residents a "few" have committed terrible acts using the name or god or religion as a motivation or justification for these acts.  Both the creation and movement of so many refugees is the main issue.  How we, call us moralists, stupid or concerned, address this problem remains an issue.  Historical events, the causes and the actions to address problems such as immigration must be considered in light of their times.  Likewise history will reflect our response in the same manner.  There is a serious immigration problem today.  We can ignore it, wall it off mentally or physically, or try to correct it.  We need people who can provide solutions not just tell each other the problem.  You both are informed and follow what's happening.  I don't have an answer but you and others must have some solutions to propose.  That's what we need, good or bad but solutions to discuss.
Nexist Xenda'ths Added Apr 21, 2017 - 10:31am
The few who are terrorists are actually irrelevant to my point. Would you want to bring in numbers of "Operation Rescue" or "Focus on the Family" believers? If you bring in large quantities of people who do not share the same basic assumptions about what is or is not "right" (e.g. toleration of Homosexuality, Women's Rights, etc, etc), that will shift the baseline away from these things.
 
History will paint a similarly rosy image. Either we will protect our values, or the people with the new values will celebrate how they brought us to light.
Jeff Michka Added Apr 24, 2017 - 1:36pm
What Trump isn't saying about the border wall is that it's not their to keep "Them" out, as much as it will be to keep us "in."
Nexist Xenda'ths Added Apr 25, 2017 - 1:42am
Jeff: That is kind of funny. Only the rich and the military bother to go outside this country on any regular basis.

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