What Happens When You Die?

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Most people say there is nothing beyond this life, because they are either naive to what the Bible says or they are in full denial.


The Bible says: “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all.” Therefore, when we die, we cease to exist. Which we see in the following two Bible Scripture:

Ecclesiastes 3:19-20 - 19 Surely the fate of human beings is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath; humans have no advantage over animals. Everything is meaningless. 20 All go to the same place; all come from dust, and to dust all return.


Psalm 146:4 - When their spirit departs to God, they return to the ground; on that very day their plans come to nothing.


Death is a fact of life. Death is not an accident; it is an appointment. We all have an appointment with the death angel, which is seen in Hebrews 9:27 - 27Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment.


Christ's death paid the penalty for past sins of Old Testament saints and future sins of New Testament saints. The requirement for salvation has always been faith. The object of one's faith for salvation has always been God. Our salvation is still based on the death of Christ, our faith is still the requirement for salvation, and the object of our faith is still God, which is seen in 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 - For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,


When a Christian permanently dies, what happens in 2 Corinthians 5:8 occurs -8 We are confident, I say, and would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord......................While our body is in the grave, our souls goes immediately into the presence of God when we die.


When a person's body is in the grave (death), it is in a dreamless sleep, which is total darkness. Many people who have experienced death up to one hour before they were revived, stated that they were in state of total darkness. And this is true.


When people who do not believe in Christ (non Christian) dies, their body goes into the grave, where they are in total darkness, while their soul goes to Hell.


When the second coming of Christ occurs, what is said in the following Bible scriptures occurs:


1 Thessalonians 4:16-18 - 16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. 18 Therefore encourage one another with these words.


John 5:28-29 - 28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned.


This is what happens to all the people who rejected Christ:


Revelation 21:8 - But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”


Matthew 13:42 - 42 They will throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 


God gives all people the free will to choose to have ever lasing life in Heaven or condemnation in Hell. It is your choice.



Gerrilea Added Nov 17, 2018 - 10:31pm
Marty K---
"Most people say there is nothing beyond this life, because they are either naive to what the Bible says or they are in full denial."
So, there are only two false choices in your worldview?  Either denial or ignorance???
What about those of us that have been dead?  I was dead for 8 minutes on March 17th, 1984.  There was no light, no tunnel; just absolute "unknowing".  I woke up 3 days later in St. Joseph's Hospital here in Buffalo.  I didn't know I was dead, I had to be told and had they not found me in the snowbank, so many things could have happened. I could have gotten crushed by a snowplow or actually been "all dead" and not "mostly dead".
The realization there was "nothing more" has shaped who and what I am today.  I cherish every moment, I live to love and share the beauty that life can be, only if you allow it.  BUT you must allow it, first.  The world is ours to create.
The question I continually ask myself:  Will this world be a better place because you were here?
 Your "faith" and religiosity has forced humanity into nice neat little boxes.  They "accept" so much evil because they've been brainwashed into "believing" this life is punishment until the "hereafter" where they will be "raised up" and partake in "life everlasting" full of joy, roses and, in some cases, 72 virgins.
So, I must reject your thesis and false choices you present to us here tonight.
FacePalm Added Nov 18, 2018 - 2:01am
Here's what Christ said:
Mark 17:26 <font color="red">"And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? 27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err."</font>
and again:
Luke 20:37  <font color="red">"Now that the dead are raised, even Moses shewed at the bush, when he calleth the Lord the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob. 38 For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him."</font>
Despite what the OT has written in it, i trust He who is King of kings and Lord of lords above all of them; what He says, i trust.
Now, as to Hebrews 9:27, let me ask you this:
Did Christ raise any from the dead?
If He did(and i trust you believe it so), are any still alive in their earthly bodies?  If not, then such as these have indeed died TWICE, therefore the TRULY operative part of 9:27 must of necessity be "and then the judgment," for it's obvious that in several biblical examples, as well as a great multitude of testimonies since, an ABUNDANCE of people declared dead have risen again to give their testimonies.  In each and every one of these cases, "the judgment" was obviously that they get another chance.
As to "where" these eternal souls incarnate, that would be left to Him who is the perfect judge of all, the Searcher of Mind and Heart, who cannot be deceived by anyone.  I will not attempt to sit in His seat, for i haven't earned the right...and especially, i do not wish to judge any other as unworthy or make a hasty assessment, for Christ was clear in many examples that the very measure we use for "others" is the same that will be used on US, the exact and PRECISE same, when the time comes.
One of my grandfather's favorite poems was called "Unexpected," and it went like this:
"I dreamed death came the other night
And Heaven's gates swung wide;
With kindly grace, an angel came
And ushered me inside...
There, to my surprise, stood folks i'd known on earth;
Those i'd judged of unfit, or of very little worth.
Indignant words rose to my lips, but never were set free;
For every face showed stunned surprise; no one expected ME!"
i'm glad you live your life to the fullest, now; i've seen too much, heard too much, experienced too much to doubt at all concerning life after death.
Stone-Eater Added Nov 18, 2018 - 5:20am
I'm with you on that. There was nothing before birth and there won't be anything after. Just because humans can't imagine being dead because they don't know anything else than being alive doesn' mean there is something after death.
But believing is comfort. That's all.
James Travil Added Nov 18, 2018 - 6:09am
I'm with Gerrilea and Stone, and like Gerrilea I also had a near death experience which amounted to nothing at all. Also unlike the ignorance of Marty's assumptions I grew up raised in the Christian community, graduated from a Christian high school, and studied the Bible. It's because of this fact that I know that, even if a deity exists, it's not the evil, moronic false "god" of the Bible which in all it's infinite wisdom doesn't even know how old the world is, contradicts it's endlessly, promotes racism and all forms of bigotry, and could never see into the future to name even a single solitary invention from our modern world. And that is a mild assessment of the ills of that mythical being. If I needed to pick a deity it most certainly would not be Biblegod. 
Marty Koval Added Nov 18, 2018 - 8:16am
In my posting I did explain what happens to people who died for a short while and then came back to life.
When a person's body is in the grave (death), it is in a dreamless sleep, which is total darkness. Many people who have experienced death up to one hour before they were revived, stated that they were in state of total darkness. And this is true.
When these people died for a short while, their spirit had not yet departed. It was God's will to keep you here on earth. If He didn't want you to live, your spirited would have departed and you would not be here today.
George N Romey Added Nov 18, 2018 - 10:10am
There is zero, nada, zilch factual evidence that something happens to us after we die other than we decay.  If we people want to believe that's one thing.  However, presenting something else isn't facts, its fantasy.
The bible is about as practical as pink angels and pennies from above.  
Lindsay Wheeler Added Nov 18, 2018 - 11:11am
Our souls are immortal. God is eternal, no beginning, no end. But humans are immortal; we have a physical beginning, but our souls have no end.
To live for God is our goal, and to be with God. Jesus Christ is prove positive George of the fact of resurrection!  There were many witnesses. Jesus also raised two from the dead Himself!  Every Christian is a Witness to the Resurrection of Christ and all who believe in Him and live holy righteous lives will in turn live in Christ for eternity. 
I am a Witness to the Resurrection of Christ. 
Stone-Eater Added Nov 18, 2018 - 11:17am
Witness ? Ok. I was witnessing a sunset today too ....
Neil Lock Added Nov 18, 2018 - 12:01pm
I haven't died yet, so I don't know what it brings. And to conduct an experiment - kill yourself, and see what happens - would be stupid. How would you report your results to those still alive?
Maybe there's justice after death. Maybe not. Maybe there's a heaven and a hell; and maybe not.
Gerrilea: Will this world be a better place because you were here? I can't speak for the world, but WriterBeat at least is a better place because of your astute comments. Thank you.
Bill H. Added Nov 18, 2018 - 12:32pm
I believe that we are all part of a finite commodity of life on Earth that continuously recycles itself (reincarnation).
We are now in the human form, but we have been here long before, possibly in many other forms, and will continue to return in various other forms over time. 
Jeff Michka Added Nov 18, 2018 - 1:28pm
In hell I'll be good company, sez "The Dead South," and they're right.  I suppose the worst fate would be reincarnated as a ERW rightist, or having to spend an eternity with Lindsay, or Faced, or TraitorLynn. 
Fmontyr Added Nov 18, 2018 - 2:24pm
Marty, you are preaching a religion, one of many religions current and past.  These are all based upon myths which people needed to comfort them from the unknown.  Now in a more advanced age it has become increasingly obvious that places like Heaven and Hell do not exist.  We are slow to change here in the US.  A number of the more intelligent nations are greater than 50% atheist and increasing.  When I die, I expect to decompose, "soul" included.  Otherwise my soul will go to hell where is will be very content.
Eric Reports Added Nov 18, 2018 - 2:37pm
Gerrilea and James Travil, different people have different death experiences.  You cannot dispute those who have seen God or their dead relatives.
The false gods of today (celebrities, money, fame, success) promise no afterlife.  
Jesus Christ does.
opher goodwin Added Nov 18, 2018 - 2:50pm
Oblivion. That's all. Everything else is wishful thinking.
Open your eyes and love it all. It's marvellous, majestic, precious and awesome - and it's all we'll ever have.
Each second is a revelation.
opher goodwin Added Nov 18, 2018 - 2:51pm
Eric - you think he does - but he doesn't. Wishful thinking doesn't make anything real.
opher goodwin Added Nov 18, 2018 - 2:52pm
Jeff - imagine eternity sipping tea, singing in the choir forever, with Cliff Richard.
I prefer death.
opher goodwin Added Nov 18, 2018 - 2:53pm
Lindsay - Oh yeah? Where's the proof?
James Travil Added Nov 18, 2018 - 3:33pm
Which Christ, there were many. Christ is a title not a proper name, and the Christ myth of the Bible is plagiarized from other preexisting cultures. Again I say if there is a deity he or she probably isn’t a plagiarist (or a mass murderer, or a warmonger psychopath, or a racist bigot, or a historical revisionist, or blind to the future, or a self-contradicting liar, or a fool, etc). Why continue to push the most ignorant and evil of obviously false "gods"? I for one can't take a god person seriously that scrapes the bottom of the barrel. What kind of "god" hides for most of human existence whilst other deitys are well known around the world? Makes no sense. 
George N Romey Added Nov 18, 2018 - 3:44pm
I don't doubt there was a very charismatic man by the name of Jesus Christ that roamed the land, taught the virtue of goodness, and was executed by political leaders.  Whether he himself portrayed himself as the son of "god" (or a "god)") or his followers did is apparent.  However, ultimately I think he was nothing more than a man with lots of good ideas.  Whether deity or not the human race, even the ones that claim to be his followers seem not to understand one word he uttered.
Notice the Catholic Church in itself is pretty much everything Satan was cracked up to be.  
Lindsay Wheeler Added Nov 18, 2018 - 3:52pm
Judgement cometh. 
"The Fear of the Lord is the beginning of Wisdom, and all who have it have great understanding". 
Now, we know who are the fools are. It is interesting here, how these non-believers judge themselves and want to go to hell. 
Hell is a Trash-can. God can not destroy a soul; his only alternative is Hell, where there is Fire and Brimstone and the gnashing of teeth. It will not be a pleasant experience---and they will know nobody is there. They will be alone in space and time, tortured by the demons who are themselves tortured, eaten and being eaten...forever. 
See they not only reject The Good, but God has rejected them as failed units, driven by hate, and self-loathing. Rebels to the core---they will die as rebels. 
James Travil Added Nov 18, 2018 - 3:57pm
I for one have lots of doubts that a historical Jesus existed. Besides the fact that the Biblical Jesus is plagiarized from other pre-existing cultures (which is kinda a BIG clue right there), there is a mountain of more questions https://www.nobeliefs.com/exist.htm
Doug Plumb Added Nov 18, 2018 - 4:26pm
No one knows or ever can know what happens when you die. Christianity is a matter of faith, a maximum of judgement.
  The empirical evidence of the maxim of judgement being a good one is all the great societies that Christians have created. This is because only under Christianity does jurisprudence become a science in itself rather than the arbitrary design of a man such as in statutory religions.
  Science just explains observations, that is as far as it can go, asking it to go further would be like buying a can of paint and expecting to fly back home on it.
  See my Dialectic.
Doug Plumb Added Nov 18, 2018 - 4:29pm
Science, or the scientific method can only be used to expose non truths. No truth comes from the scientific method. Only truth is by reason with a precept as required by reason, ie the common law, the rational law that would be adopted among rational creatures. This common law or golden rule is why Western societies are so great.
Gerrilea Added Nov 18, 2018 - 4:34pm
Marty K--- Our lives and the meaning we give them is up to us to decide.  I do understand your Christian faith, I was a devote Catholic and had a very personal relationship with God/Jesus. 
I must agree, God wasn't done with me yet.  Read my replies below.
Neil Lock--- Bless you for that beautiful reply.  We only have this day, given to us with no strings attached.  What will we make of it?
Facepalm--  Dito:  "...I've seen too much, heard too much, experienced too much to doubt at all concerning life after death..."
Many here know of my journey and the amazing things I've experienced.
Eric Roberts--  "...You cannot dispute those who have seen God or their dead relatives..."
I'm not sure that I did reject God, that would be a rejection of myself.
I reject the God™ and religiosity presented in the Bible that act as chains around our minds, our bodies and our souls.  There are only two things "verbatim", from God, in that Book: The 10 commandments, written by the hand of God AND the prayer, "The Our Father", spoken by Jesus.
Those are the tools we were given.  We need nothing more.  The rest is for us to discover and experience.
And I've never disputed the claims of people seeing, hearing or feeling their loved ones, after they've passed.  If they live in our hearts, they never die, correct???
"From dust we come, to dust we shall return."  
Cullen Kehoe Added Nov 18, 2018 - 5:29pm
It's interesting that every civilization that's ever existed believed in an afterlife. Until our super smart scientists began pushing the theory of evolution about 150 years, that's only when Western society began to reject the idea. 
So why do people generally FEEL like there is an afterlife? Why do they want there to be an afterlife? Animals have no apparent longing. 
Why are people generally afraid of death? 
Why is it so painful for us to endure the death of a loved one? 
It's almost like death feel unnatural to us. 
Fmontyr Added Nov 18, 2018 - 5:35pm
ER, you said. " There are only two things "verbatim", from God, in that Book: The 10 commandments, written by the hand of God AND the prayer, "The Our Father", spoken by Jesus."
First, the 10 Commandments, thought to be a moral code, are a joke.  Something like six of them are in praise of god himself as if he the almighty god needed the praise of little people.  Other religions had far better morality codes.
The Lord's Prayer is a Catholic Church construct.
"Faith-based knowledge is like regular knowledge, but without the knowledge."
                   -  Herb Silverman
opher goodwin Added Nov 18, 2018 - 6:56pm
So Jesus teaches about saving lost lambs and this callous god of yours burns people for eternity.
Not a nice guy. No thanks.
opher goodwin Added Nov 18, 2018 - 7:00pm
Cullen - you've got to wake up sometime.
Our ancestors were superstitious. They believed in all manner of daft things. Doesn't make any of it real though, does it?
We seem hardwired to believe in religion. We have trouble facing our own death. Freud said religion was a mass delusion.
I think he was right.
It is perpetuated by brainwashing kids and wishful thinking.
If god wanted to convince people an appearance at the superbowl might be a lot better than circulating archaic tribal writing.
TexasLynn Added Nov 18, 2018 - 7:32pm
Marty, thanks for the post... there is a bit of debate (from a Christian perspective) what happens to our soul, to our conscious selves, in the interim between death and judgement.
When it comes to death and what comes after, two scriptures come to mind for me:
1) When Jesus tells the thief on the cross "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise." Luke 23:43
2) The Parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man - Luke 16:19-31
Like life, I suspect that interim is like a vapor, that appears for a while and vanishes...
The question is what I call a "non-salvation" issue.  Meaning what one deduces from the scripture concerning that question has no bearing on one's final destination.  That said, we are to study and divine as best we can.
Gerrilea Added Nov 18, 2018 - 8:33pm
Fmontyr--- I said that.  When it comes to faith, it's immaterial whether we agree or not.
The 10 commandments were/are the Mosaic Covenant. The foundation of our Western World.  Christians saw/see Jesus bringing a New Covenant to the world with life everlasting through faith in Him.
Isn't that the whole point of this article and the debate is spawned?
Yes, other religions may have "better" criteria one could follow and that's the kicker, it's your choice.
Something I've noticed with your articles and replies, you don't want others to have a choice. 
As for your dig against the Catholic Church, hilarious.  I could write a book on what I see wrong with the Church today.  The foundational principle of that New Covenant is the prayer, "The Our Father".
From where I'm sitting, it's a pretty sound plan. Love one another, learn to forgive, don't be tempted (by gluttony, false prophets, your brother's wife) or whatever AND then protect us from evil.
Boy that last one most of us miserably fail at.  Our "faith" tells us there is "life in the hereafter" so we settle for what little goodness may be bequeathed upon us from our masters on high, such as our political/corporate/religious elite.  Many are are mislead by false logic, propaganda and Pavlovian conditioning.
The latter is something you're great at.
Gerrilea Added Nov 18, 2018 - 8:42pm
Opher G--- The concept of "hell", as described in the Bible, is fear-porn to keep the sheeple in line and obedient.
"Early Christians did not write extensively on Hell and appear not to have taken these as literally as many do, today."
I have a first-hand experience of what hell actually is....NOTHINGNESS.
May you never experience it.
Marty Koval Added Nov 18, 2018 - 9:17pm
The statement that the Lord's Prayer is a Catholic Church construct is incorrect.
The lord's prayer was quoted by Jesus Christ at the sermon of the mount, which occurred prior to His Death in 33 AD. This is recorded in the book of Matthew 6:5-13. The Catholic church did not come into the existence until many, many years after the sermon of the mount. There were churches planted by Apostle Paul in Italy, but they had nothing to do with the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church claims it is a continuation of the early Christian community, but since they added doctrine that was against Jesus teachings, that rules out that they are a continuation of the early churches.
FacePalm Added Nov 18, 2018 - 9:50pm
Y'shua ha Maschiach(the Aramaic way of writing 
"Jesus the Messiah," or "Anointed One"), said this:
Luke 16:31
"And he said unto him, 'If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.'"
History tells us that many thousands, perhaps hundreds of thousands or more, have risen from the dead and given their testimonies since Y'shua died and arose again - but it is exactly as He said, such as these won't be believed, even should they rise from the dead.  Perhaps those who see nothing is the result of them having sought nothing, for "He who seeks, finds."  i suspect that the reverse is just as true...like those who intended to prove that light is a wave vs. those who wanted to prove it is a particle...the expectations of the experimenter affected the result.
So, let the dead bury their dead, and shake off the dust from your shoes until they're ready to hear the Truth; if they're never ready, let them alone, for the Lord will sort them, eventually.
There are various destinations; the demons the Anointed One cast out were most afraid of the Bottomless Pit, it seems.  Some fear the flame, some fear the bitter cold, some fear the agony - there are at least a couple of places where the bible teaches "what i have feared has come upon me."  Even Chris Cornell sang about the principle in "Fell On Black Days."  The lyrics go: "Whatsoever i feared has - come to life."
1John teaches, however, that love, when perfected, drives out all fear.
James Travil Added Nov 18, 2018 - 10:50pm
It's humorous the notion that a mythical fictional character like Jesus gave a literal sermon. Who else gave a literal sermon, Hurcules perhaps? Why not. 
Fmontyr Added Nov 18, 2018 - 11:19pm
Marty, it's obvious that you are steeped in the Christian religion but are not a religious scholar.  I don't want to shake your faith but will try to put biblical matters in their proper context. The four gospels were written by multiple people, more than those named in the book titles, and none of those writers actually knew Jesus.  The gospels are all hearsay, word of mouth hand down, so how could Jesus be quoted for the prayer at the Sermon on the Mount?  There are many wide variations in gospel stories meaning that none of them are actual historical writings about Jesus.
There are a number of scholarly books about how both the old and new testaments came into being.  Nothing in the bible are the literal words of god or Jesus.
The first writings of the new testament were in Aramaic, then translated into Greek, and then again translated into Latin.  Nothing translated came through verbatim.  The early Catholic church wrote the Lords Prayer and there is no evidence that Jesus ever spoke those words.
Correct me if I am wrong but you are not allowed to use actual words of the bible for your evidence.
Fmontyr Added Nov 18, 2018 - 11:36pm
As for the Ten Commandments, I trust no one actually believes that god gave them to Moses on a mountain inscribed on two stone tablets.  There is debate about their having been plagiarized from other codes of conduct.  One of the possibilities -
According to Wikipedia:

"Some historians....have argued that the Ten Commandments originated from ancient Egyptian religion, and postulate that the Biblical Jews borrowed the concept after their Exodus from Egypt. Chapter 125 of the [Egyptian] Book of the Dead (a.k.a. the Papyrus of Ani) includes a list of things to which a man must swear in order to enter the afterlife. These sworn statements bear a remarkable resemblance to the Ten Commandments in their nature and their phrasing.....The Book of the Dead has additional requirements, and, of course, doesn't require worship of Yahweh." 
Gerrilea Added Nov 19, 2018 - 2:18am

Fmontyr---God man, have you never seen the 10 Commandments with Charleston Heston???
If I'm not mistaken, wasn't the code of Hammurabi the foundation for the 10 commandments? AND isn't our Western Civilization based on Judaeo-Christian teachings encapsulated in said? YEP.
The story of Gilgamesh has the same flood described with Noah. Shit there's almost direct copying from one to the other.
"The closest parallel between a biblical text and the Epic of Gilgamesh is seen in the wording of several passages in Ecclesiastes, where a strong argument can be made for direct copying. The author of Ecclesiastes frequently laments the futility of “chasing after the wind” (for example, Eccl 1:6, Eccl 1:14, Eccl 1:17, Eccl 2:11, Eccl 2:17, Eccl 2:26, Eccl 5:16, etc.), a notion reminiscent of Gilgamesh’s advice to the dying Enkidu: “Mankind can number his days. Whatever he may achieve, it is only wind” (Yale Tablet, Old Babylonian Version). Earlier in the story, Gilgamesh persuaded Enkidu that two are stronger than one in a speech containing the phrase, “A three-stranded cord is hardest to break” (Standard Babylonian Version, IV, iv). Similarly, Ecclesiastes tells us, “Two are better than one, because they have a good return for their work…. Though one may be overpowered, two can defend themselves. A cord of three strands is not quickly broken” (Eccl 4:9-12)."
As for the actual "author" of the 10 commandments, the faith I was raised in makes that very clear, GOD wrote them on stone tablets and gave them to Moses and it was verbatim.  The "translations" are where the devil is in the details.
Thou shall not murder, is what was written,  it says nothing about 'killing".  Murder is premeditated or planned and includes acts of passion and revenge.  Killing to defend yourself, killing, as in, capital punishment or killing in war is not forbidden.
As for the claims of multiple authors for the same book, you'd have to present evidence, opinion doesn't cut it if you are going to attempt to debunk something.  Were there various authors of the books included in the Bible? Yep.  It was compiled over hundreds of years and wasn't it the Council of Nicaea, 325 AD, ordered by Constantine, that "formalized" those books?
Okay, so Christianity is a hodgepodge of various authors based on firsthand testimony and eyewitness accounts, most of whom were his disciples and members of his inner circle...  I'm sure there's some colorful embellishing here and there.  JESUS was a man first, that part is ignored and downplayed or denied outright.
All I can say, without building my own time machine and going back and looking around for myself to meet up with this character called Jesus, I accept that he did exist, in the flesh and blood.  The "mustard seed" of faith.
NOW for what he actually taught, that's still a raging debate for many.  That's why I focused solely on what those authors claimed was "verbatim" and not their opinion or their colorful storytelling.
What did the man actually say??  The prayer, "The Our Father", that's it.  And this comes FROM their own writings.
Gerrilea Added Nov 19, 2018 - 2:19am

The accuracy of those words is based on THEIR standards and history, not mine.
As for there being no proof that Jesus existed...that may be true in some circles but I'd offer this:
Historically speaking we have only 9 fossilized teeth from alleged ancestors of Chimpanzees.  There are NO fossilized remains of Chimps that exist today.  Does this mean they don't exist because we have no historical evidence of their existence?
Surely not.
I don't get caught up in logical fallacies too much.

opher goodwin Added Nov 19, 2018 - 4:18am
Gerri - I guess nothingness is where we're all heading - but as we won't exist it won't matter. It would only matter if we were conscious. I do not believe we will be.
Doug Plumb Added Nov 19, 2018 - 4:30am
re " Until our super smart scientists began pushing the theory of evolution about 150 years, that's only when Western society began to reject the idea. "
Evolution has so many holes in it that its like swiss cheese but celebrity scientists push it and people believe they are scientific when they believe it. Its non scientific to believe it and scientific to find holes in it - there are many scientific reasons to not believe it, #1 being that entropy always increases. Nature doesn't self organize.
Flying Junior Added Nov 19, 2018 - 4:31am
What about the Sermon on the Mount?  There are the Beatitudes found in Matthew but there is some evidence to believe that the sermon recorded in Luke may have been the same teaching.  The teachings of Jesus found in Chapter 10 of the Gospel of St. John about the Good Shepherd?  The Vine Dresser?Jesus's fervent desire to eat the Passover Feast with his disciples?  The Parables?  The Last Supper?  Suffer the Children?
You don't believe that the words attributed to Christ were uttered by the Christ?   Then why believe any of it at all?
opher goodwin Added Nov 19, 2018 - 5:03am
Doug - rubbish. You display your ignorance. I've taught evolution for decades. There are no holes in it. As the study of DNA unfurled it became even clearer.
What are these supposed holes to which you refer?
opher goodwin Added Nov 19, 2018 - 5:06am
The trouble with any discussion of Christian records about Jesus is that nothing was written in his lifetime. Nothing was written by anybody who knew him. Nothing was written by any of the players. It was all written from memory, from different sources, long after they were all dead. Oral tradition is far from perfect.
Flying Junior Added Nov 19, 2018 - 5:15am
What happens when you die?
It's lights out!
Stone-Eater Added Nov 19, 2018 - 5:15am
Jesus was the same thing as Ron L. Hubbard and others later. The founder of a sect. Once a sect becomes bigger, it's considered a religion. That's all.
Lindsay Wheeler Added Nov 19, 2018 - 5:56am
"Only a Fool says in his heart, there is no God". 
Look at all the Fools here!  All these people giving up on Beauty and The Good, of being friends with God. 
Stone-Eater Added Nov 19, 2018 - 6:23am
I guess the "fools" here are in the majority. So it's questionable who the fools are ;.)
Marty Koval Added Nov 19, 2018 - 8:48am
Your are correct to say that the  first four Bible books in the New Testament were not written by Jesus. The writers of these books used the words of Jesus to write these books. Apostle Matthew and John were with Jesus during His ministry and quoted His saying in the text in red lettering.  The book of Mark and Luke were written by these two men using the words from Apostle Peter and Paul respectively. These words said by Jesus were also marked in red lettering. Like Matthew and John, Peter was with Jesus directly when He said these words.
When you compare the red letter text in the four gospels, the consistently in wording is very close to being identical. Are these words 100% exactly as Jesus said and in the same sequence is in some cases probably not. The point is that the message being recorded is the same.
Steel Breeze Added Nov 19, 2018 - 9:11am
after death i expect choices;
opher goodwin Added Nov 19, 2018 - 9:17am
Lindsay - I never give up on beauty. I gave up believing in ancient Arab fiction though.
opher goodwin Added Nov 19, 2018 - 9:22am
Marty - of course the words in the bible are not the accurate recording of what Jesus said. They were passed down through memories. 
Personally I think there was a guy called Jesus who was the head of a small Jewish cult. It was Paul who set about making him into a superstar and sexing up the message. It was Constantine who decided what was in and what was out. He burnt the contradictory ones as heresy.
I question all of it from the concept of god to the deifying of a cult leader.
Fmontyr Added Nov 19, 2018 - 9:28am
"Faith-based knowledge is like regular knowledge, but without the knowledge."
                   -  Herb Silverman
Disbelief in god(s) is the coming thing.  Get with it!
opher goodwin Added Nov 19, 2018 - 9:42am
Fmontyr - belief without evidence always seems daft to me.
Bob Added Nov 19, 2018 - 9:50am
The Bible is a vile book filled with violence and inhumanity.
Rape is a property crime against a woman's father! 
Deuteronomy 22:28-29 states: “If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, he shall pay her father fifty shekels of silver. He must marry the young woman, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.” In other words, you break it, you buy it.
Slaves needed to be happy with their condition: 
1 Peter 2:18: “Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the cruel.” 
Genocide of the Amalekites:
1 Samuel 15:3 “This is what the Lord Almighty says... ‘Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.'” 
First Five Commandments:

I am the LORD thy God. (Ego)
No other gods before me. (Precious Ego)
No graven images or likenesses. (Even more precious Ego)
Not take the LORD's name in vain. (Don't say my name with a shitty attitude)

I'm sure those are the top 4 things humans shouldn't do. This is the idiocy of bronze age beliefs. 
Surely God would select illiterate sand tribes to provide revelation and not the Chinese who had a fully functioning advanced society.
Remember either you support the book or you don't. This a la carte version every different christian sect spits out is plain heresy according to the legends themselves. Credulity to this nonsense is a travesty. We can't forget what those who believe they have God on their side have done in history. There's a quote on the suffering of man and how God's apparent indifference to injustice and suffering is his "mysterious ways".
“If there is a God, He will have to beg for my forgiveness.” -- This is a quote etched on the wall of a concentration camp.
Liberal1 Added Nov 19, 2018 - 9:58am
I respect the fact that some things are eternal and immortal.  Just look at Keith Richards.  That SOB will still be going strong when the earth is a big cinder.
Stone-Eater Added Nov 19, 2018 - 10:53am
Good comment. The "fools" are really taking over LOL
Eric Reports Added Nov 19, 2018 - 10:57am
"Oh, ye of little faith..."
FacePalm Added Nov 19, 2018 - 2:23pm
Ok, all y'all who deny that any such being as a Creator exists, how willing to take an injected integrated circuit chip into your body will you be, once it becomes mandatory?
Liberal1 Added Nov 19, 2018 - 3:01pm
FacePalm, Keith Richards is against the injection of micro-chips.  His body is an acoustic temple that will last forever.  
TexasLynn Added Nov 19, 2018 - 3:48pm
Bob >> We can't forget what those who believe they have God on their side have done in history.
Granted... our track record is poor. 
But if history is to be the judge.  If death and human misery the scale... those who believe man is as close to god as it gets (Stalin, Mao, etc...) win the prize by tens of millions.  Even Islam, pales in comparison.  In fact, all religious atrocity combined, pales in comparison.
Stones and glass houses come to mind.
Ken Added Nov 19, 2018 - 5:27pm
I could have gotten crushed by a snowplow or actually been target="_blank">"all dead" and not "mostly dead".
Wonderful Movie - sad note, William Goldman - the author and screen writer (also won oscars for writing Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid and All the President's Men) is officially all dead as of this weekend, so I am sure someone went through his pockets and looked for loose change...
Doug Plumb Added Nov 19, 2018 - 6:22pm
re "What about the Sermon on the Mount?  There are the Beatitudes found in Matthew but there is some evidence to believe that the sermon recorded in Luke may have been the same teaching.  The teachings of Jesus found in Chapter 10 of the Gospel of St. John about the Good Shepherd?  The Vine Dresser?Jesus's fervent desire to eat the Passover Feast with his disciples?  The Parables?  The Last Supper?  Suffer the Children?
You don't believe that the words attributed to Christ were uttered by the Christ?   Then why believe any of it at all?"
He wasn't "the Christ" any more than I am "the Plumb". This is a UN/Satanist agenda to change the character of Christ and make Christ about something other than reason and the common law.
The stories in the NT are there to illustrate the practical application and meaning of that common law, that law that can never be perfectly expressed and is the reason for the comfortable surroundings you find yourself in. Without it you would be property of someone else and ideas of self determination or freedom would be completely foreign to you.
Opher, I explained what is fundamentally wrong with evolution. I don't care if you taught it in high school. I am not in high school.
Doug Plumb Added Nov 19, 2018 - 6:50pm
@ Bob re "The Bible is a vile book filled with violence and inhumanity."
  Those old tube type radios sounded like shit and the tubes always needed replacing. The bible was written by philosophers of law to develop laws that everyone could live by. They were not written by God but are the word of God as deduced by the very best minds.
  We have the NT which introduces reason (common law) into scriptures, just like we now have transistors and our radios sound better + we have computers and better developed formal logic.
  Christians do not have or keep slaves and very few people that called themselves Christian were involved in the slave trade. Christians do not sacrifice other people.
  Politicians are not "lawmakers" like the bubble headed bleached blonde on TV says they are. Law comes from theologians and philosophers, not the morons people keep electing. Most of those simpler minded folks would have a very hard time explaining what a law even is, maybe even a harder time than Opher would. They both think laws are written by men rather than deduced from logic in Christianity. Western Jurisprudence was the FIRST science. Hundreds of years later, physics and biology came along.

Logical Man Added Nov 19, 2018 - 7:05pm
What planet do you live on, Doug?
Logic in the Bible?
Christians didn't keep slaves?
Western jurisprudence is anything but science.
As for politicians not making laws, you are correct, but they do produce statutes by the bucketfull and call them laws.
When you die, you go back to where you came from. Once you didn't exist, which is the state you return to.
Religion is for those who can't face this.
Fmontyr Added Nov 19, 2018 - 9:29pm
Doug, this couldn't be further from the truth -
"Christians do not have or keep slaves and very few people that called themselves Christian were involved in the slave trade. Christians do not sacrifice other people."
Have you no knowledge of who owned the four million slaves when the Civil War began.  An estimated 12 to 15 million slaves were brought to the Americas.  British and French Christian gentlemen were the primary owners of slaves in the Caribbean islands.  Spanish and Portuguese Catholics were the primary owners of slaves in South America.
Guess who burned heretics at the stake, conducted to Spanish Inquisition and took care of the witches in New England.
Fmontyr Added Nov 19, 2018 - 9:46pm
TexasLynn said, "In fact, all religious atrocity combined, pales in comparison (to that of Stalin, Mao, etc. who win the prize for 10's of millions slaughtered).  Might I suggest that the slaughter/deaths of around 90 million Native Americans, north and south, after Columbus was the work of Christians.  European Christians slaughtered untold millions of Africans as they Colonized that continent.  Add India, southeast Asia and other areas occupied by European Christians and I bet the number far surpasses that of Stalin, Mao, etc.
Christians have been killers big time.
FacePalm Added Nov 20, 2018 - 12:09am
Keith Richards is against the injection of micro-chips. 
His body is an acoustic temple that will last forever.
Soul, yes; body, no.  He's no saint whose body will not decay(there's at least one example i can recall, offhand).
But i noticed you didn't answer the question posed.
Already, many people are volunteering to take the chip.  In Sweden, in order to use public transportation, accepting the chip is now MANDATORY.
So, have you voluntarily been chipped like a dog?
If/when democrats take power again and pass LAW to make the insertion of a microchip mandatory HERE, will you accept it or reject it? 
This IS, after all, where the "China model" is going...
Gerrilea Added Nov 20, 2018 - 1:55am
Stone E--- "I guess the "fools" here are in the majority. So it's questionable who the fools are ;.)"
Bigotry cannot be reasoned with. So is the fool the person whom is bigoted or the person whom tries to change their mind???
Now, I'd be squarely in the fool's corner.  You decide which corner it is.
Bob--- "That vile book...."  Yes, you are so right.  So much evil has been committed, allowed and reveled in throughout the centuries in the "name" of god and the book, Koran or Talmud...all attributed to him.  Whether we agree or disagree, history presents us with the fruits of said labors.
The thing is, God didn't do it, man did.
Each of us are faced with choices, each and every day.  Do I participate in a system of evil?  To support my children, my family, my lifestyle?  Do you buy the latest "I-phone" or widget created by and through slave-labor?  Do you rationalize your acceptance of the evil and give countless  excuses why it "must be that way"???
"Be in the world but not of it", comes to mind.
You see, there are some simple and what I describe "truthful" things contained in that abomination against GOD.  That's how they hook you in.  The best lie is one with truth scattered throughout.
That said, I don't begrudge others their beliefs, let them have their cake...for they shall never be able to eat it nor gain sustenance from it.
We can only control one thing, the choices we make.  The very first thing God gave us, which separated us from the beasts of the wild, FREE WILL.
Would God deny us the greatest gift He gave us so the rationalizations for our own evil would be absolved as is eluded here:
“If there is a God, He will have to beg for my forgiveness.” -- This is a quote etched on the wall of a concentration camp.
NOW, as for your comparison of the "sand tribes" to a thriving Chinese society....PSHAW...How did they get that way? What have they become today?  Proof is in the pudding.  It's estimated over 1.5 million died forced into slave labor to build the Great Wall.  Chinese women feared giving birth to males, they'd be taken as children TO work the wall.
There is no difference, HUMANITY revels in evil.
FacePalm Added Nov 20, 2018 - 1:57am
This prophesy would be one reason why the PtB are so intent on getting rid of/censoring those who follow Christ; they want the knowledge of this fact expunged from as many memories as possible so as to deceive as many as possible...which can also account for the censorship/removal of so many from the main leftist silicon valley platforms, as well.
That said, i have read one preacher make a very good case for the SSN being the Mark, as well.
It's based on what the original word for "mark" meant, which referred to a plate - usually clay - that Roman slaves were required to wear which contained the name/address of their master, and what the particular specialty of the slave in question was; some had theirs made of leather or metal, depending on their value to the owner, anything from iron to copper to gold or silver. 
The SSN has been and is being used as the key to a compendium of FAR more knowledge than the original mark, and anyone who can claim to be an "authority" can swiftly unearth every record ever made on you via it's use.
In addition, the words used for "in your hand" could easily be construed to be a social security card, and "in your forehead" can also mean "memorized," as in the forebrain, where your memory is located.
"The technetronic era involves the gradual appearance of a more controlled society. Such a society would be dominated by an elite, unrestrained by traditional values.  Soon it will be possible to assert almost continuous surveillance over every citizen and maintain up-to-date complete files containing even the most personal information about the citizen. These files will be subject to instantaneous retrieval by the authorities."
-- Zbigniew Brezhinsky, National Security Advisor to President Jimmy Carter and advisor to 4 other presidents, Executive Director of Trilateral Commission
Source: from his book, BETWEEN TWO AGES
As best as i can discern, the SSN simply does not effectuate the level of control those who pretend to be PtB want, as illustrated in the following exchange:
Aaron Russo, an actor, was introduced to Nick Rockefeller, and after time became somewhat of a close friend. Russo ended the friendship after Rockefeller began to divulge things to him about the Rockefeller and Co.'s plans for the world(see David Rockefeller's quote in previous blog post). Russo told of a conversation they had, and this is what he said was discussed:
Rockefeller: "There's going to be an event, Aaron... and out of that event, you're gonna see, we're gonna go into Afghanistan... we're gonna go into Iraq, to take the oil and establish a base in the Middle East... you're gonna see guys going into caves looking for people that they're never gonna find... by having this war on terror, you can never win it... it's an eternal war, so you can always keep taking people's liberties away... "
Russo: "How are you going to convince people that this war is real?"
Rockefeller: "By the media... the media can convince everybody that it's real... you keep talking about things, you keep saying it over, and over, and over again, and eventually people believe it..."
(Russo commenting on the whole thing: "you create the federal reserve in 1913 through lies, you create 9/11, which is another lie, through 9/11, then you're fighting a 'war on terror', and all of the sudden you go into Iraq, which was another lie, and now they're gonna do Iran... one thing leading to another, leading to another, leading to another")
Russo to Rockefeller: "What are you doing this for? What's the point of this thing? You have all the money in the world you'd ever want, you have all the power... you know, you're hurting people, it's not a good thing..."
Rockefeller: "What do you care about the people for? Take care of yourself... take care of your family."
Russo: "What are the ultimate goals here?"
Rockefeller: "The ultimate goal is to get everybody in this world chipped with an RFID chip, and have all money be on those chips, have everything be on those chips... and if anybody wants to protest what we do, or violate what we want, we just turn off their chip."
Gerrilea Added Nov 20, 2018 - 2:02am
Face P & Sunshine Kid---
John 12:31: "Now is the judgment of this world, now shall the ruler of this world be cast out; and I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to myself" (John 12:31-32 RSV).
Satan has always ruled this world.  Would we expect nothing less???
FacePalm Added Nov 20, 2018 - 3:07am
The evil one is not ruling now.  He THINKS he is.
This is yet another reason to back Trump, for the globalists are allied with evil so despicable as to be a horror to even think of, much less speak or ruminate much over - and Trump has firmly announced his opposition to them...and better, taken steps to round up the pedophiles AND their money(viz. Trump's Dec. 21, 2017 EO). 
Curious how MSM has kept silent in the face of these roundups, don't you think?  They're quick to castigate and demonize virtually EVERYTHING else about Trump, but this?  One of the most important stories EVER, much less in this century?  Why the silence?  Not even Fox is reporting on this; the ONLY place you'll find reporting on groups like Veterans for Child Rescue is at various online sites.
Cullen Kehoe Added Nov 20, 2018 - 4:01am
I'm happy the left-leaning folks are honest. 
To sum up many of their arguments, mankind was really stupid for many thousands of years. Only 150 years ago during the Industrial Revolution did mankind finally step forward into enlightenment. The theory of evolution guided us into this new nirvana in which we live. 
The ancient Romans, for instance, had much less accumulated knowledge than we have, yet made great walled cities with indoor plumbing, buildings up to 6 stories tall, domed structures, cement that could dry underwater, nearly a continent-wide empire with free trade and people flowing wherever the jobs and resources beaconed. (They created machines--wheels--powered by water, of the type still used far into the Industrial revolution, but they were stupid so it doesn't matter.) 
Oh, and my liberal friends love to repeat the bad arguments that Christianity was made up at the Council of Nicea in the 320's A.D.
The fact that 2 Roman historians document that Roman Emperor Nero was burning Christians alive in the 60's A.D. doesn't matter. (Who were these Christians going to their deaths 250 years before the religion was made up.)
That is actually more important than people realize because Nero was emperor BEFORE Jerusalem was destroyed. So if some preacher (let's call him Paul) comes and tells you these amazing things about a guy who lived 30 years, maybe SOMEBODY might jump a ship and go to Jerusalem and check it out. Ask some people. 
You have Jewish Historian Josephus confirming the existence of Jesus, John the Baptist, and Jesus's brother James (who the Bible says wrote the 'Book of James' in the New Testament). 
You've got Pliny the Younger, Roman Statesman writing around the end of the 1st century A.D. to the Roman Emperor about what to do with Christians who refuse to worship the Roman gods. (Who were these early Christians who existed 200 years before they 'made up the bible'.)
My point is, my liberal friends, the talking points people are giving you are not good arguments. They just aren't. They are convenient. They might even seem logical to you. But they aren't true. 
(One more, Jesus's most complete sermon, the Sermon on the Mount, is in Matthew who was the only formally educated disciple of Jesus. It's likely that he functioned as a kind of scribe for many of Jesus's teaching. It makes sense that he took the narrative structure of Mark, and added all the notes and writings he had of Jesus's teaching, and added it in.)
Fmontyr Added Nov 20, 2018 - 9:02am
Being non-religious now doesn't mean that I was always.  I know that the apostle Mathew is not the author of the Gospel of Mathew.  Who exactly wrote Mathew between 70 and 110 AD is unknown.  There is much scholarly information about the bible, but it seems that those who ought to know such avoid it like the plague.  Faith, I suppose, makes anything possible.
Gerrilea Added Nov 20, 2018 - 9:55am
Cullen K--- "...to repeat the bad arguments that Christianity was made up at the Council of Nicaea in the 320's A.D."
Um, YES, The Nicene Creed came out of those meetings.  The Bible was composed and compiled with various "teachings" & "writings" that became official canon for the Christian faith.  The divinity of Jesus was decided.
YOU need to read your Christian History.  DON'T rewrite history to suit your arguments, let's deal in facts here.
"Matthew who was the only formally educated disciple of Jesus."
I was NEVER taught that, he was a tax collector!  Or in other words, a thug, the muscle for the Empire!
FacePalm Added Nov 20, 2018 - 9:57am
"To those who believe, no proof is necessary; to those who do not, no proof is possible."
The Shroud of Turin has been claimed to be fake for centuries - yet all of "science" has no idea how to scorch fibers in a negative image so delicately that it can only be seen from a distance of 12' or more.
Cullen Kehoe Added Nov 20, 2018 - 6:03pm
@Gerrilea - The Nicene Creed is a statement of faith. There are two other creeds as well written at other times. 
The Bible was officially codified in the 320's A.D. but the books of the New Testament were all written in the 1st century A.D. 
Tax collectors...what do they need to be able to do? Read and write in probably Latin, Greek, and Aramaic. 

They need to be able to do complex mathematics. 
In the first century A.D., who would fit that description? Someone who was formally educated. 
Gerrilea Added Nov 21, 2018 - 2:07am
Oh My G.O.D.--- Cullen K--- 
Matthew was a "publicanus", NOT the Roman "censor", or chief "tax collector".  Matthew was a thug, plain and simple. Hired by the chief tax collector to go and get the money.  He'd shakedown anyone he wanted, for as much as he could force out of them.  Mafia gangsters, nothing more.
He was Jewish and most assuredly spoke Hebrew and Greek and maybe Aramaic, as did most from Galilee.
As a Catholic, our profession of faith (or oath) is the Nicene Creed although we recite the Apostle's Creed at mass as well.
I understand you're trying to attack what you describe as "liberals" but the truth is exactly this:
"...Christianity was made up at the Council of Nicaea in the 320's A.D..." 
Constantine tried to unite the Empire under one doctrine and belief system.  Prior to that, Christianity was anything but organized.  I'd say this, had he not formalized the Christian faith, it would have most likely dissolved into nothingness..
Isn't that what happened exactly when King James split the Church?  How many Protestant "denominations" are there today??? Each one claiming their way is superior?

Which one of them today can withstand the assault of Islam? Or the pseudo-"New Age" crap? Or even more vile, the religion of the almighty State???
Can the teachings of Jesus alone bring us all to the truth? One truth???
I'd like to believe it can.
Frosty Wooldridge Added Nov 22, 2018 - 10:01pm
I figured out what happens when you die by the time I was 15.  If you possess an IQ over 120, you realize that all the religions and all the promise of an afterlife equal to a huge: B*llSh*T story of all time.
When you die, your energy releases into the universe and your flesh and bones turns to dust.  You're done. You're finished. You're no longer a living creature.  You don't go to heaven or hell or any other fictions place.  
You're done. Get over it.  You lived, you died, you're dust.  
Gerrilea Added Nov 24, 2018 - 8:22am
Frosty ---
Now that is just a very cold & meaningless universe you/we exist in.
Where does the energy that was you go?
Fmontyr Added Nov 24, 2018 - 11:08am
There is a word, entropy, which covers that.  Get your HS science textbook.
TexasLynn Added Nov 24, 2018 - 11:35am
Frosty >> You're done. Get over it.  You lived, you died, you're dust.  
Thus the apostle Paul's admonition to those who believe that...  "If the dead are not raised, let us eat and drink [and be merry], for tomorrow we die."
Gerrilea Added Nov 24, 2018 - 5:16pm
Entropy, defined, because I don't think you understand it:

"1 thermodynamics : a measure of the unavailable energy in a closed thermodynamic system that is also usually considered to be a measure of the system's disorder, that is a property of the system's state, and that varies directly with any reversible change in heat in the system and inversely with the temperature of the system broadly : the degree of disorder or uncertainty in a system

2a : the degradation of the matter and energy in the universe to an ultimate state of inert uniformity Entropy is the general trend of the universe toward death and disorder.— James R. Newman
b : a process of degradation or running down or a trend to disorder The deterioration of copy editing and proof-reading, incidentally, is a token of the cultural entropy that has overtaken us in the postwar years.— John Simon

3 : chaos, disorganization, randomness

4 statistical mechanics : a factor or quantity that is a function of the physical state of a mechanical system and is equal to the logarithm of the probability for the occurrence of the particular molecular arrangement in that state

5 communication theory : a measure of the efficiency of a system (such as a code or a language) in transmitting information, being equal to the logarithm of the number of different messages that can be sent by selection from the same set of symbols and thus indicating the degree of initial uncertainty that can be resolved by any one message..."
Which "science" book/ system of belief would you like me to buy into?


Fmontyr Added Nov 24, 2018 - 8:16pm
Gerrilea, 2a.
Jeff Michka Added Nov 25, 2018 - 9:04pm
Geezus, another bible bang.  Anyone having any fun banging it?  Do you wear condoms?  And we got ol Lindsay the ultimately lame declaring he is a Witness for Geezus.  Pass Lindsay his sainthood.  Yanno, if Faced wants to he can damn me to gawd.  Ryan will divorce Vinny to marry Faced, if he does.  Faced last damnation of me was....cute and so very loving.   You Xtains, for all but a drop, are rank hypocrites.  Real easy answer to this article.  We die, we rot.  Ultimate bye bye.
Ward Tipton Added Nov 26, 2018 - 6:12am
This is too easy ... you become a democrat voter! 
Gerrilea Added Nov 26, 2018 - 7:25am
Fmontyr--- I see my position more closely related to the first definition.  The closer the system reaches absolute zero, the less we can understand with "science". "Entropy" for me equals, uncertainty.
Since I accept that matter can neither be created or destroyed(except when you mix "anti-matter" with "matter"), therefore, We must live in a closed system where everything becomes everything else, eventually.
Research and experiments where particles were reduced to just above absolute zero, the more the particles were in multiple places at the same time, some "breaching" the magnetic containment like it wasn't even there.  This is where "quantum chips" come into play, as I understand it.
We shall never "know it all", to do so would mean we'd have to have a brain bigger than the Universe itself.
Gerrilea Added Nov 26, 2018 - 8:00am
Ward T--- Aren't you describing Hell instead?
rycK the JFK Democrat Added Nov 27, 2018 - 9:04am
Liberals will populate the hot floors of Hell. 
Marty Koval Added Nov 27, 2018 - 2:52pm
rycK the JFK Democrat
Any person who does not accept Jesus Christ into their hearts and repent their sinful ways, will end up in Hell. This includes people of all political, social, religion positions.
People reject Christ because they love their sin and they hate having it exposed by God’s light. People don’t want God interfering with what they consider “a good time,” and they don’t believe the warnings of Scripture that they are under God’s judgment now and will face it eternally when they die. People think that they’re basically good and that God will overlook their faults and give them credit for their good deeds on judgment day. So they don’t repent of their sin and believe in Jesus Christ to save them from God’s judgment.
All people must remember what is said in Luke 18:18-19 -A certain ruler asked him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. “No one is good—except God alone.
God is made up of three, persons: God the Father, Son of God (Jesus) and the Holy Spirit. And God is the only one who is good.
Fmontyr Added Nov 27, 2018 - 3:54pm
rycK -- Are you saying that your loving three-part god will condemn to everlasting damnation all those who have no knowledge whatsoever of Jesus Christ?  Explain and/or justify.
rycK the JFK Democrat Added Nov 27, 2018 - 4:15pm
If I were a Hindu I would just say that they are stuck on the wheel of life and have to deal with it round after round after round. 
If I were a Muslim I would just say that they are non-believers and do not deserve Heaven. Who cares?
If I were a very progressive liberal I would just say that since there is no god it matters not a whit. 
There are many ways to express damnation as a final outcome. How  many of us choose their own path to damnation, salvation or nonexistence? This is a matter, obviously, of faith and depends upon the narrowness of certain beliefs that transcend facts and outcomes. 
If you do not believe, then that is not a problem. 
rycK the JFK Democrat Added Nov 27, 2018 - 4:21pm
"Any person who does not accept Jesus Christ into their hearts and repent their sinful ways, will end up in Hell. This includes people of all political, social, religion positions."
This is a strict interpretation of the scripture. A  problem occurs when some may be called who never heard the Word. 
Marty Koval Added Nov 27, 2018 - 4:36pm
rycK the JFK Democrat:
The Bible is clear that apart from Christ, you can't go to heaven. Jesus said, "No one comes to the Father except through me" (John 14:6).
How does this apply to someone who never hears the gospel? The Bible says, "The truth about God is known to them instinctively. God has put this knowledge in their hearts. From the time the world was created, people have seen the earth and sky and all that God made. They can clearly see his invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature. So they have no excuse whatsoever for not knowing God" (Romans 1:19-20).
No one has an excuse for not knowing God. That knowledge comes to us naturally—much like the way we instinctively reach for water when we're thirsty. It's not something we have to learn.
And it's not just instinct that draws people to God. God uses visual aids too—his creation. We can see God through the divine design of nature.
When someone responds to these instincts and "visual aids" and truly reaches out to God, God will make sure that person understands his or her need for Christ. God, who loves us beyond comprehension and wants everyone to go to heaven (2 Peter 3:9), will arrange the details for that person to know the gospel—through a missionary, a tract, a Bible, whatever.
God is an awesome God, and nothing will stop him from getting the good news to even the most remote parts of the world, "to the ends of the earth" (Acts 1:8). And as if to prove it, God even gave Apostle John a glimpse of heaven, where he saw people "from every tribe and language and people from every nation" (Revelation 5:9).
The bottom line: God is obviously able to reveal the truth about himself to anyone, anywhere. But he often uses us to do it. That's why Jesus' last words to us were instructions to tell everyone, everywhere, the good news of God's love (Matthew 28:19-20).
God calls all of us to share his love with the people around us. Maybe he's even calling you to take this good news "to the ends of the earth."
Fmontyr Added Nov 27, 2018 - 5:27pm
 "If you do not believe, then that is not a problem."
rycK the JFK Democrat Added Nov 28, 2018 - 5:43pm
That is  your problem. Who in the religious community listens to people with no faith??
Your disbelief is not a problem for me.